Understand those Magic Items, yours and the enemies' ...
Understand those rules, yours and the enemies'
Understand those spells, yours and the enemies'
Lighten up with those Humor.
***[zombie screening unit ...]
> They better not charge with zombie unit ... zombie will just crumble ...
> The "crumble" unit must be one that's designed to be destroyed and thus
> deny teh charger's carrying over ...
[General's weapon of choice]
Tony Scott wrote :
> Actually I prefer the Rending Sword. At S5 you'll reduce most saves down to
> 4+ at best anyway, and all you need is two wounds (which multiply to 4) to kill
> off most generals. Heros will die to a single wound. All this and it's 25 points
> cheaper.
"Well, Flail of Skull is my thing ...
Flail needs 2H to wield, so no shield, but your General don't use shield
anyway, and it costs only 5 extra pts to that of rending SW, and +2 st on 1st round to
another -2 to save, and 1w=2w ...
===================================================
[Declare all charges before taking measure of frenze]
One convention my group follows is that you must make charge
declarations before you measure to see whether frenzied troops
charge. This prevents 'measuring" for other charges you might
consider. You decide whether or not you want to declare a charge
with the frenzies. After all charge decs mad then measure and see if
they must charge.
====================================
The only things that I can think of that are immune to break tests are
Any Swarms
Orc/Gob wild squigs -- Squig Hoppers....WAAAGH....
chaos Slaaneshi Champions
Slaneesh non-wizard characters
Chaos Spawns
Dwarf Dwarfs with Rune of Courage
Dwarf Dwarf Slayers
Empire Flagellants
Empire Steam Tanks
HighE White Lions led by General
Orc/Gob Fanatics
Orc/Gob Gaints who yell and bawl a lot.
Skaven Screaming Bells
WoodElf Unwounded Treemen
WoodElf wardancers who shadow's coil.
Undead Carrion and all skeleton (warrior/horsemen/chariot/catapult) but
will loose model per combat resolution point difference.
Undead Zombie
And anything with hatred or a crown of command is nigh unbreakable
Ikit Claw.
=====================
>> > The answer to your Jezzail probelm is simply terradons, with their
>> > auto S6 hits the rats will soon be so much pate.
>>
>> I wouldn't do that personally, as the Jezzails can stand and shoot the
>> terradons, and T2 terradons can't survive a jezzail
>
>Sure. I mean jezzails are S5 hits, right? (I don't have the skaven book)
>But they only get one shot, (I think) and since there are 2 skinks on
>each Terradon, there shouldn't be too many casualties. Besides, what's
>the BS of a skaven, 3? They'll need a 6 to hit (-1 for chargers, -1 for
>over half range). I don't think stand and shoot damage will be a
>problem, but then again, I've never tried it.
It depends on how many Jezzails are in the unit being charged. If it is
a small number 3 or 4 then they will be OK. If it is a large number
like 9 or 10 then it could be nasty for the chargers.
--
jason cooper
=======================
I would tell mr. chump that the unit of 8 heros/general/BSB is illegal.
You cannot have a unit of heroes. If he had 5 normal guys in their than
it is fine, but if it was just the heroes and characters then they must
remain 1 inch apart from one another since they each count as a unit by
themselves unless they are leading a unit of troopers.
=======================================
Kamakaze the "6 pack"
------------
V.C. can have two items only so ...
this is what my Kamakaze V.C normally ...
V.C on skelly mount with barding, copper/bronze sigil sword (init
modified to 9 or 10 and is a magical weapon), HoW (go boom @ 3" radius
of 7+D6 St Wound, 1 Wound = D6 wound)
V.C. should cast his only spell card before going into H2H.
Total cost (241)
(V.C. 200)+(HoW 25)+(C./B. S. Sw 5/10), (steed +2 + barding +4)
Or use chariot ... if I have lots of character/scarce points (not
likely)
Just love those 6 heros-champion-general-standard pack (6 pack ?).
==============================
Since swarms are fielded at 50/100 pts per base. Unfortunately, they cannot
be fielded as separate bases. if you buy 3 bat swarms, it counts as 1 300
point monster.
If you field halfprice swarms (only Skaven and Lizardmen right now), then
fielding one and only one base comes out of non-scarce points. if you field
more than one base, it comes out of scarce points.
================================================================
beware of the Lizards leadership though even if you break those suckers the 3d6
leadership usually brings even Skinks back into the battle.
===============================================================
Characters cannot form into a unit without RnF ...
A unit of just a general, some heros and a battlestandard is not allowed.
They must be (?)" apart ...
<< With one exception. It is legal, and possible to have a unit
made up entirely of Dwarvern Slayer Champions, (ie Giant, Dragon and
Daemon). However, in saying this, that would be one bloody expensive
unit. >>
===================================================================
Nope, not entirely correct. Unless he joins a skirmisher unit, a character
will not move like a skirmisher: He'll still take terrain penalties for
movement and will have to "march move" to go double his normal movement
allotment, subjecting himself to the
"can't-march-if-within-8"-at-start-of-turn" restriction. If he joins the
unit, neither of the foregoing apply.
-Walt
wickedwalt@aol.com
========================================================
Sorry Colen, but your wrong on this one. Under pursuit it says that you go
the distance you roll, and if you catch the fleeing enemy they are
destroyed. Nowhere does it say that you stop where you caught them. Page
43 of the rulebook. (I practically have this one memorized it's come up so
many times).
"Rand"
=========================================================
Will Chris writes: ...
> o I believe our inherent strength is in numbers. Tournie 10 rules
> specifically punish large armies as they always go last
>
Disagree. It is usually best to go last. Time for those decisive
charges, and grabbing quarters of the table.
=============================================================
Q: Can the Empire army take Ogre, Halfling or Dwarf characters?
A: No. If the Empire army was to be able to take these characters, they should be described in the Empire Army Book. The
Chaos Army book specifically describes the Minotaur lords, and beastman champions allowed for Chaos Armies [Empire
Army Book & Chaos Army Book].
Q: can dryad take champion ?
only the special character ... drycha ... standard and musician are allowed
=============================================================
here is one that would actually work
>
> XXXXXXXX XXXXXXXX
>
> C HHHHHH C hhhhhh C
>
> KZZZZZ
>
> although i would not use any zombies at all :) check this formation out
> and you will see by figuring the possible marchroutes and movement routes
> you have a very flexible way of a setup now. remember in order to screen
> you do not have to hide everything behind. if you move the flexible
> chariots just a bit you can always get them behind the screen. between the
> screen and the main unit there is just about 1-2inch room so figure it is
> a close setup and you can afford to let the chariots hanging back even
> more. now if someone crashes into your screen you can charge from front
> and flank. this works even better with some additional units, though this
> will be covered in part 3 :)
=================================
hernethehunter@juno.com (Charles A Green)
thanks Tom for the advice. I hadn't considered taking wraith champs for
every unit. I'll keep that in mind. What would you suggest for the
screening unit? I was considering bat swarms, but i have other plans for
those. Maybe zombie? I don't have any of those minis, but I could
improvise.
I was going to use the banshee (special character from circle of
blood) to bring out the ubiquitous fanatics. She's a spell casting
wraith with a 24 inch flying movement. I figure her with hand of dust or
Gaze of nagash could do some real damage if I can get her behind the
enemy lines. Good for flanking, too.
Essentially, I was going to use wraiths, ghosts and bat swarms as
screening units, followed by wight cav and regular cav for flanking.
Throw in some vampires and mummies in these units for extra hitting
power. The main unit of skeletons will most likely be led by a necro
lord (maybe heinrich). I was gonna use a big honking unit of these, and
try to get in h2h with any unit already engaged with the cav units.
Probably use some magic-enhancing items to throw skeleton in front of the
enemy cav (wolf riders and such).
I think I can do a fairly good job with this conept. I will post
an army list if I actually get a chance to work on it this week.
Thanks again.
===============================
Q: Are creatures immune to non-magical weapons, immune to all breath weapon attacks?
A: Although not weapon attacks per se, breath attacks are physical attacks,
and therefore they would be immune. However, they should _not_ be immune to
`gaze' attacks like those used by the Gorgon or Cockatrice. They would be
immune to the following types of attacks: Dragons Breath, Greater Daemon
Breath, Great Taurus Breath, Chimera Breath. [Primarch]
==============================================================
A: Because a unit is immune to break tests/psychology does not mean that
characters in the unit are immune to break tests/psychology.
Therefore, if a wight, wraith, mummy tomb king, liche, vampire, or a necromancer is
in a unit of skeletons and it loses a round of hand to hand combat, two things happen:
1) Extra skeletons in the unit die. If more than 1 skeleton unit is involved in the
hand to hand combat, each unit loses an additional number of skeletons equal to the
combat resolution.
2) Characters in the unit not immune to break tests, take break tests with the
appropriate combat resolution modifier. If the character fails its break test,
it is destroyed, flees, etc.
[Primarch]
===============================================================
From: Tom Welliver
IN order to issue a challenge, the challenger needs to be either
a) in base2base with a character
b) in a unit which is in base2base with the unit the character is in
this means that if C is a character, and X are normal troopers,
XXXC
CXXX
is not a valid challenge since neither of the characters are in contact
with the opposing unit.
XXXC
NXXXV
is alson invalid, since there is no character that is allowed to accept the challenge
if the chaos character was a single model, and he charged up into BTB with
your vampire lord, then the vampire would have to either accept or hide
behind the unit.. the necromancer cannot accept or decline the challenge, as
he is not in BTB with the chaos character.
if the chaos was in a regiment, then both necromancer and vampire are valid
targets for a challenge, and it doesnt matter how may points either is worth..
================================
Not sure what you mean by "bad". If bad means against the spirit of the
game, I would hesitate to call it that. Let Nigel decide. He wrote the Bret
book. I have cut the Skaven unit down, though. Current big unit in current
version of tournament army is 961 points, including attached things. The
problem is the Seer. If he went somewhere else, that's almost half the
points in the formation. Perhaps from an asthetic point of view, it's a
little over the top. OTOH, I know of at least one army in last year's staff
tournament which had a 1200 point unit in it, using the Lizardman list. To
summarize:
1) The big unit is dangerous, in that it puts all your eggs in one basket.
If it is routed, you lose.
2) The big unit is dangerous to your enemy, since if he has no way to
counter it, he's dead.
3) The big unit, even if its fast knights, will charge a maximum of three
enemy units per game, and more often only two, if is denied the chance to
rout a small unit and redirect into another one. So...
4) It's possible to avoid it with all but two (possibly three) units. If
you can sacrifice two units and kill some of the army around the big unit,
you might come out ahead.
I think that's the biggest problem with the big unit. It's possible to
avoid it and pull off a low margin win. Against Lizards, Skaven or Orcs,
it's easy to avoid LeUnit, since they are slow. Against Brets it's tough,
since they have that 16" (sometimes more, with virtues) charge. I will
probably think of more to say on the subject, but I have to work just
now...
Yes, it is. Of course, you are far more likely to see Gaze of Nagash and
VHDM win it than Curse of Years. The Brets have to charge things they can
_wipe out_ in one shot, without getting killed for it on the next Undead
turn. That can prove to be a problem if the Undead are played well.
In game terms, it's not legal. Characters have to be in the front rank.
Best way to protect the big frog from "contact fused" devices (like the
Black Gem or the 'Eadbanger Banner is with a Warrior Familiar.
> Are you trying to tell me that your US GT Bret army wouldn't beat any
> undead army you can come up with? I find that hard to believe.
>
Hmmm. Not the USGT army, but maybe the Canadian version. Much more
dangerous, and anti-magical too boot.
Movement: Brets get to determine where the attack is made, and they better
kill (well, destroy) what they hit, or they will be bogged down.
Shooting: Neither Undead nor Brets are a shooting army. Bill's eight bowmen
might kill a few zombies, but mostly they hold ground. Undead catapults are
unreliable, but great in numbers. Can't have too many of them, though,
under the scarce rules. Which would you rather have? Catapult or Wraith
Champion?
Close Combat: Brets win initially, and Grail knights are immune to fear, so
they won't break even if they lose to the big skeleton unit. The Errants
and possibly squires will be sacrificed killing screening troops, and
possibly going after war machines, if need be. The hero with tress and
appropriate virtues and sword will be somewhat useless against the Undead,
unless he can assassinate the general. Black Gem will be good to lock up
Wraiths, to avoid break tests.
Magic: High magic (four spells; perhaps Banishment, FC and/or Hand of Glory
will be drawn). Drain magic would also be nice. Two dispell scrolls for
when the power cards run out, and a destroy scroll. The choice would be
whether to destroy VHDM or Gaze of Nagash. High magic would be a game
winner here, if anything would.
It might be prudent for everyone going to the USGT this year to take one
or two anti-undead items, just because we already suspect there will be
three or four top players bringing Undead. Though I suspect some will
switch to Chaos when the new book comes out. Power gamers with too much
money are drawn to Chaos like flies to cow patties...
[chariot vs PCB]
The problem with chariots and PCBs is that the fog effects kill models
at the beginning of the HtH phase, while IIRC, chariot impact hits are
worked out during movement. So the entire unit could vanish before fog
happened.
There was an errata in WD about this. Not sure which issue, but it clearly
states that the PCBs only check for their own gas during combat. Thus, they
are always protected from missiles by the low-level fog, and have to check
whether they die or not when they swing the flails in HtH and the fog gets
thicker. I would love to see what a life-size unit of these guys would look
like charging an enemy. It would look like a big, yellow green fogbank with
screams coming from inside it. Very nice...
--T. Rat
--T. Rat
How about give him a skull staff and know ahead of time ...
=================================
Psy. 101:
If you fail a fear test while charging, you simply do not charge.
If you fail a terror test while charging, you turn tail and run the other direction.
If you are charged and fail a fear test, but outnumber your opponent you will need 6's to hit.
If you are outnumbered you run, just as if you failed the terror test.
===================
> I think I understand ... like the e-mail I just send ... undead can veto
> those "safety device" and cheeze up on mages like one 4th and one 3rd
> Necro. with 7 or more slots to put spell/power items \
This is actually rather ineffective - remember the good player will veto
book of secrets EVERY time he sees it in an undead army... probably POS as
well...
>... and with veto
> undead can kill other army's safety devices such as dispel and maybe low
> LD's army's CoC ... the key is "repeat spell casting ability" is where
> the money is for Undead and veto make it even deadlier ... right ?
Undead is deadlier with veto yes - but for many reasons...
>
> I understand more now listening to you and realize why I hate this veto
> thing so much ... you see, I made a choice early on playing undead ... I
> don't like to use spells to zap opponent to dead. I like to use it to
> improve my RnF and use my RnF to defeat my enemy, yea, tactical slow
> death ... 2 or 3 Necro. was not my way and this veto force me to field
> lots of Necro. to ensure supermecy and thus screw up my tactical dream
> ...
You need not rely on spells....
>
> So this veto thing cannot really prevent certain advantage/disvantage,
> well ok I'll say it cheeze balls ...
It can make the cheese much less of a problem - also this is why IMO that
composition scoring is very important to a tourney...
> it may in fact worsen it, and a good player is always going to be on top
> no matter what ! ...
Yes, the best players will end up on top regardless of restrictions - the
others can whine and complain all they want - the best player s will always
end up where they belong...
>
> Orc and Goblin really doing well ? hmm ... like to hear their input ...
>
> Not question your ability TO excell over the veto bit, i don't like it
> because it
> force me to become cheeze ... my cheeze, not yours ...
You need not cheese up - really - watch for battle reports from USGT -
Jeremiah Karnes/Tom Van Dyke/Ron Spitzer - one of them will win (Unless
Tim, Mark or I get lucky and figure out how to beat them) and you will see
one mean list...
=============================================================
fly boy charging my general, what should I do ?
Just challenge him with your other characters
I only have 4th edition, waiting,, waiting ...
rulebook4 pg66 talk about b2b contact then challenge ...
F
xxxxxAxxxxBxxxx
So the fly boy come down and attack "A", from what the play normally go
there is
no chance for "B" to challenge
but
F
xxxxHABxxxx
Date: Wed, 22 Oct 1997 09:47:32 -0400 From: Tom Welliver
Also, fliers that charge are moved to the exact center of the front of the
unit they charged. the model at the exact center cannot be the necromancer,
since that spot is reserved for the leader of the regiment or the champion
of the regiment.. with standard and musician on each side of the champion,
there is no way for a flier to charge and get in base to base with any otehr
characters, UNLESS the flier declared a ground charge, which severely limits
its maneuverability :)
since H,A,B are all 20x20 and F is larger ... so H OR B should also
touch the Flyboy's base and challenge is thus possible ...
===============================================================
> > The idea was that say you have a single character (say on a horse)
> > charge another character also independant. There is no rule that says
> > you cannot (at least that i can find) issue a challenge.
>
> > It may not really have much usefulness, but has anyone ever
> > seen this come up?
> >
> Many many times. In fact, I often take advantage of the
> challenge rules to do this. It means that I get to whomp who I want to
> whomp without any worries. It is also important if you want to use
> something like Van Hels Speculem - which can only be used in a
> challenge.
> My Khorne Hero challenged a Black Orc Hero on Wyvern
> -> Stop enemy hitting me and hurting me whilst I try to
> snot the enemy monster. Also, I was after overkill to ensure that the
> BO ran when I killed the Wyvern as the BO was suitably protected. In
> the end, 1 wound was caused on each side over 3 turns - absolutely
> horribly dice rolling.
=================================================================
>But imagine a bretonnian character with a 1+ armor save
>fighting say an empire character who has say a 4+ armor save. It wouldn't
>hurt for the bretonnian player to fire some bowmen shots into the combat
>since he cannot hurt his own character and may in fact cause a wound to the
>empire character. A challenge issued by the Empire player would prevent that
>from happening. It may not really have much usefulness, but has anyone ever
>seen this come up?
Nope.
Our group wouldn't allow the archers to fire into melee involving an
important person of their side, unless the army leader was in their unit
for some reason.
We figure that shooting at important people isn't done, unless the boss
himself says so.
We also assign a higher probability to hitting the closest in the melee,
but modified for other stuff - like if he's a big target, or fighting a
large unit etc.
( House rules ).
================================================================
> Q: can you tell which chariot has the banner ?
Yes. One model should have a banner on it...
> Q: can you tell if the banner is magical or not ?
No, since you wouldn't know if the flag was magic if it were in a unit of
normal grunts, IMHO.
================================================================
Ahhh, now I see. Well obviously the 5th wraith would give a LOS roll,
however even with only 4 you've only got a 1 in 5 shot of getting hit
(randomized between 4 wraiths and the vampire...)
OTOH, that extra wraith may keep your vampire from geting into HtH
against a lone character with a magic weapon...
Not to mention the extra 75 points. Everything is a trade off...
Lord Tuman Elnikov
FAQ Zombie
MKA Tony Scott
tscott@ezlink.com
http://www.ezlink.com/~tscott/tuman.html
On Thu, 23 Oct 1997, Tony C. Ko wrote:
> (a) a unit of 4 wraith and one Vampire.
>
> WWVWW
>
> or
>
> (b) a unit of five wraith and one vampire
> WWVWWW
>
> give Vampire better protection ?
=============================================
Will Chris
>
>Sheesh, Leadership is important, but it doesn't win battles for you.
>Deployment and movement do.
Tell that to my opponent last night who had 2 units with big hth
capability an no leaders. Once I drew his general away I took them out
with less powerful, cheaper units and a bit of luck.
For some armies some things are more important. To generalise :
Undead - Magic
OG - Leadership
Elves /Dwarfs- Deployment
Chaos - Choosing your engagements
Wood Elves - Movement
All these things are important to everyone. A better tactician / general
/ knower of the game will make more of these things. It is a FACT that
some armies have inherent strengths and weaknesses, this combined with
the different models we use to represent our armies are the
distinguishing features.
I picked the armies I thought I knew more about, but I suppose :
Bretonnian - Anti Magic / Choosing Engagements
Skaven - Leadership
Empire - hmmm, lots of problems here with what I believe to be one of
the
best armies to collect but hardest to design. I guess
Empire generals
would have biggest problems with holding in HtH until their
other units could get in. They are a jack of
many trades and a master of none.
Slaan - Good alround army, I can't see any specific area where the Slaan
have
to focus their attention. Obviously keeping their general alive while
still
trying to benefit from his hth abailities.
Chaos Dwarfs - Dont really know this army at all well.
Like I said, I dont know these armies books as well.
My point being every army has strengths and weaknesses of some sort. A
general must try to strengthen his weaknesses without reducing his
strengths. Now there are
many ways to do this and we all develop a favourite. I think it is a
good tactical idea to try different ways of achieving this goal, more
importantly I think playing with variety is more fun.
Will Chris
Wargfang
==================================
Carmen A Tanzio
Some of your ideas on wraith units are also applicable to ghosts. One can
field twice as many ghost models for the same cost as a wraith unit, which
makes it much cheaper to get a full rank bonus for a ghost unit. Even the
cost of a banner bearer is not out of the question. As you pointed out, one
still needs a killer character to inflict wounds on the enemy, and solid
leadership to save the unit should they happen to loose a combat. The real
benefit is the break test that the enemy is guarenteed to take every turn,
and the immunity to RnF attacks. And given the 3 wounds per model that can
only be harmed by magical attacks, ghosts can absorb enormous punishment
and keep yelling BOO!
==================================
[creature]
Empire long-riflemen
WE WarDancer "storm of blades" (at least one dancer must in B2B with
the "sir")
[Dwarf]
the lightning from the Anvil can pick out a character,
at least according to the Primarchs.
[special character & Monsters]
WE Wychwethyl the wild "dance of doom"
Cockatrice and Gorgon gaze attacks,
Brain Bursta
[Wizard Arcana]
Staff of Flaming Death
Staff of Lightning
Stadd of Osiris
[Magic Banners]
Banner of Wrath
[Bound Spells]
Claw of Nagash
Doomfire Ring (Item),
Skarsnik's Prodder (Item)...
Staff of Nurgle (Item, 100 pts),
[Spells]
[Battle Magic]*******************************************************
Fireball (Battle Magic, P1, one S4 hit per level of caster),
Blast (Battle Magic, P2),
[Dark Magic]*******************************************************
Death Spasm (Dark Magic, P2),
Doombolt
[Chaos Dwarf]*******************************************************
Sorcerers Curse
[High Magic]*******************************************************
None
[Skaven Magic]*******************************************************
Plague
Madness
Curse of the Horned One (Skaven P3, can turn general into clanrat),
[Chaos Tzeentch]*******************************************************
Bolt of Change (Tz, Chaos spell, P2),
Glean Magic (Wizards only)
Incandescent Assassin
Pink Fire of Tzeentch
[Chaos Slaanesh]*******************************************************
Beam of Slaanesh
Chaos Spawn (Sl Chaos Spell, P3),
[Chaos Nurgle]*******************************************************
Cloud of Flies
Pit of Slime
[Necromancy]*******************************************************
Necromancy Gaze of Nagash (P2)
nope it targets the first unit and not model!
Necromancy Drain Life (P2)
nope - even though it would affect a character being in the rolled 2D6
range you did not really target him
[Waaagh Magic]*******************************************************
Mork Wants Ya (Orc, P1),
'Eadbutt (If there are no wizards left to pick on in range), (Wizards only)
===================================
If I were building a charge screen, I'd use about twelve. Cheap and will
die at the right time when charged. As long as the general is close by,
they shouldn't panic from shooting. I wouldn't give them a standard, since
it's an extra VP if they are run down (I think; they may simply vaporize if
they lose a break test).
--T. Rat
>
>
> Ghouls can be worth it, but are very vulnerable to bitting the
controller.
> Dont lose any combat with them. And dont expect to get more than one
> offensive use out of them( damn hungry critters, i always feed them a
few
> peasants before the battle but it never makes a difference). I like to
> field them in a block of 19 including a standard plus a vampyre count. (
> at least 360 points starting to get expensive, add in a couple of magic
> items and you have a 400 point unit, kind of high for ghouls.) If you
> are aware of their great flaws then they can be fun to field and you
never
> know with a little luck they can be tough on your opponents.
===================================
Our league has an inordinate number of Chaos players due to one player
owning a huge amount of figs and lending them out to whoever else wants to
play. This resulted in a huge number of Chaos Generals who always seemed to
have chaos armor and runeshields, turning my Vampire lord's magical weapons
into expensive nonmagical hand weapons. I finally decided that if i couldnt
count on having the magical weapon, i might as well save myself 24 points
and just take an extra hand weapon. sofar it's worked out well, since noone
can veto it, or take it away (barring parrying blade or gaze of slaanesh)
ws8 s7 a5 is usually enough to put a serious hurt on other characters, so
the only loss i have over my old general is that now i dont kill a
harpy/flamer/beastman with each punch.
==========================================
a = enemy unit
b = enemy unit
c = my infantry unit
d = my fast cavalry unit
Set up is as follows:
aaaa bbbb
aaaa bbbb
aaaa bbbb
aaaa bbbb
cccc
cccc
cccc
cccc
dddddd
Can my fast cavalry (d) charge a? b? Both? How much wider does d
need to be to allow this, or is it not possible?
When you charge, you can wheel once during your move towards the enemy unit. Assuming you
connect, you can then line the troops up (sort of free movement)
In you example, your infantry unit is blocking your fast cav, I'm not up to speed on fast cav
rules. If they can turn more than once in a charge then you're Ok, since both are in your line
of sight. otherwise, they'll have to move. Another option is to charge both units- moving the
infantry should free a line for the cav to charge unit a.
=======================================================
Date: Tue, 28 Oct 1997 09:20:07 +0100
From: "Jens Rettig"
I haven't finished thinking about the differences between Ogres and Trolls,
but Trolls do have their uses.
I used some Trolls quite effectively in a game against the undead some other
time. They sucked up a charge by 2 skellie chariots, who were
promptly pulled apart by the inquisitive big creatures.
The Trolls toughness and Regeneration was too much for the skellie wheels.
After that, they continued to threat the Undead Flank !
The advantage the Trolls gave was their immunity to fear, which really helps
the Gobbos out against the undead.
The other advantage is that you concentrate points on a relative small frontage
(Who also had a nice Orc&Gobbo Army with lots of nice mobz of boyz which effectively
just block each others way ?)
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Date: Sun, 26 Oct 1997 17:11:43 -0800
From: "Bill Edwards"
We (SAWS) worked at making an effective GT restricted tourney army outta da elvishes...
Problem: Units cannot easily be made into CR crunchers. It's not easy to make units
that will break/follow/break. It is easy to make break units using BanneroDefienace,
but to also build survivable units to follow - it gets tough.
Problem: Survivability - only one unit can be built to 1+ save - makes it
difficult to rely on a shooty army (while retaining any semblance of balance).
Problem: Cost - all of the troops are expensive - you cannot make cheap interdicting units
or cheap throwaway units. Sure you can make units of 5 whatevers, but that will cost you
composition, and so is less useable.
Overall, the army is more powerful. If the tourney was built around winning only and VP
collection was not a consideration, HE would be more effective.
However, under the current GT restrictions, HE are at best the 6th best army...
In a GW tournament setting - with veto and scarce
Bretonnia
Undead
O&G
Chaos
A bunch of others
Chaos Stunties
Stunties
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From:
"Duke Tancred"
Reply-To:
warhammerfb@direwolf.com
Organization:
MailExcite (http://www.mailexcite.com)
To:
warhammerfb@direwolf.com
There seems to be a lot of confusion thrown about on this topic - perhaps
I can offer a fresh viewpoint (or perhaps not)
As I see it, there are a variety of saves...
1) Normal armour saves. Provided by armour, shields,
steeds, etc.
2) Magical armour saves. Exactly the same as (1), except they can sometimes
stop spells and stuff that specifically state 'No armour save, except for
magical armour'
3) Unmodified Armour Saves. Sauruses, Dryads(???) Savage Orc's Magic
Tatoosetc have this. Not modified by the strength of the attack,
but are not used when the attack states 'No armour save possible'
4) Wards. Black Amulet, Helm of Atrazar, Morgiana's Belt, Orion's Cloak, etc.
Unmodified, and often referred to as 'Special Saves'
5) Dodges. Wardancers and Ariel have a dodge. Always unmodified, basically
represents the target not being there when the attack is. Works against
anything except weapons which automatically hit. (Like the blade of Darting
Steel, or the Virtue of the lance) Doesn't work against spells that auto
hit either. (Though Wardancers and Ariel have separate natural dispells)
I have a very strong feeling I've missed one... Hope this is all correct. :)
Deamon save ... river-troll slime save
Well, there's Felix and Gotrek's "Gotrek's Doom" save. But that's hardly
common, or unclear. I think you got all the ones that matter.
-Damian
You missed the Savage Orc's Magic Tatoos, they are armor saves that
are not modified by anything. Those things that allow no armor saves will
negate their save though.
peltast@usa.net
Z.D.cost 500 ...
M WS BS S T W I A L
4 4 0 7 6 7 3 6 8
Got a Semi-Bad Breath ... 50% save or 1W, only magic armor save
Cloud of Flies -1 to hit in H2H
immune to PSYCHOLOGY ... so HE reaction test to dragon does not apply to
ZD
Armor save of 5,6 on a D6
Cause Terrror,fly
Wood Elf's
Forest Dragon 450
M WS BS S T W I A L
6 6 0 6 6 7 8 7 7
Green Fuming Breath
S3 hit, no armor save, and must pass LD test or Move D6 away from the
attack.
5+ armor save, fly, TERROR
Color Dragon 450 (white, black, red, green, blue)
M WS BS S T W I A L cost
Dragon 6 6 0 6 6 7 8 7 7 450
G. D. 6 7 0 7 7 8 7 8 8 600
E. D. 6 8 0 8 8 9 6 9 9 750
armor 4+
breath 50% hit under template
white: auto frozen, 1W if roll 6 in D6, no armor save,
2+/3+/4+ on D6 next turn to unfroze for dragon/G.D/E.D,
Black: W= D6-Toughness,no armor save, +1/+2 wound for G.D./E.G.
Red: flame - 4/5/6 St hit from dragon/G.D./G.D. normal save
Green: corrosive green fume: S4 hit, no armor save, LD to move away D6
Blue: R. 12" lighting continue as long as each hit is successful - 50%
to hit successful
with Strength 6/7/8 hit from dragon/G.D./E.G. and can leap till there is
no target within 12" or fail a hit
Any dragon I miss ? Chaos Dragon .. ?
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Champain ...
WA>Maybe if the MI cards were coded by (arrgh) color (don't stop reading!
WA>this has nothing to do with that other game where magic is colored and
WA>every color is cheese!) that way the ex ax, tress, CoC, Black Amulet,
WA>Helm of atrazar, forbidden rod, and other disputed Items would be
WA>"gold" then the next level would be "silver" and then "bronze". The
WA>Armies would be able to take 1 or 2 "gold" Items and 2-5 "silver"
WA>items etc.. The armies would be restricted individually as to the
WA>number and color of items that could be taken.. get the picture?
WA>Whatdaya think?
http://idibbs.com/user/andorax/whfb.htm
An interesting proposal. Another one I've found interesting involves
taking all of the MI cards and throwing them in a pot...then shuffle
well and deal them out to all players in a campaign (or if not all, at
least a doz or so to each, or something). Then, work out rules for
capturing items, trading items, finding new items, etc. It certainly
puts a different light on the game.
hernethehunter@juno.com (Charles A Green)
I saw on the net a while back something about Warhammer strategy cards.
These interested me, as I can only imagine that they are similar to 40k
cards. However, the site that had then no longer is up. Anyone know how
I might go about getting ahold of them?
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Flying High Glancing blows:
Its not actually a charge into combat.. you are making a glancing attack
against something that is flying high.. you can do this either as a charge
at someone already flying high, or if you both are flying high, just
declare that you are doing it.
everyone in the active regiment can attack, but only the attackers get to
fight. the defender is just stuck there taking it. there is no combat
resolution, so the net effect is to weaken the enemy before they charge down
from on high.
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